Keith Jones - The Power of Community in Branding
Download MP3Doug Jones (00:08)
Hi everybody, Doug Jones. I'm just welcoming my friend Keith Jones, no relation as he would say, but we're just here to talk a little bit about Keith's journey in entrepreneurship and just to give you a little bit of background and I know Keith you're gonna jump in more, but Keith is an entrepreneur that's had a pretty interesting journey through
the corporate world and then into his own enterprise as well, but he's had experience working with some bigger organizations like Maple Leaf Sports, the Olympics, Rogers Communications and others and then had a key pivot in his journey and then got into his own entrepreneurial journey with a different kind of mindset.
So welcome to the podcast, Keith. It's awesome to have you. And I know we've had lots of conversations in the past, but there's lots of interesting tidbits that we want to share with our listeners. But maybe if you could jump in and kind of tell us a little bit about your journey and how you got to where you are today.
Keith Jones (01:27)
Yeah. Well, first, thanks for having me and I appreciate you taking the time to this chat today. As far as the journey goes, how much time do you have? How far back do you know? I've told this story a few times before, but I always like to kind of talk about, or just even plant the seed of my upbringing and having a mom who is a nurse in the ER and the OR. And also part of that movement where this transition from homemaker into having her own career.
Doug Jones (01:38)
Yeah
Keith Jones (01:57)
right, and she'd work a tremendous amount of time and hours and come home and raise four kids, right. And so having that as a role model was a really impactful thing for me. My other role model was my dad, and he was a farmer, right, and it is true, the jack of all trades, like work your ass, I don't know if I'm allowed to swear on this podcast, but work your ass off and.
And as hard as seven to seven and then you're watching my dad just build and make just about anything, right? Like, hey, if something's broken, you don't call mechanic. You get out the torches, you look at the scrap metal pile and you fix it. Right. And so I think setting self up as a journey for me seeing that just from like DNA from the beginning, right? You know, your nature nurture combination is like, that's what you're born with and that's what you see growing up. So I think that's been foundational to who I am as a person and who I am today, I guess.
And then my journey is after that, I'll jump through, but I've always been a creative dude and just building and making, creating things and started off as art in school. But then I turned into making cars or building cars or building furniture. And my friends would go party on the weekend in college. And I'd be like, I'm going to go build a table and, IKEA is too expensive. So I'm going to the lumber shop and buying some pine and finding some scrap metal and making my own tables for college kind of thing. So yeah, that journey has taken me from a little farm kid to design school.
and two design schools and working out really the essence and core ideas of what design is and building logos to building brands to building, you know, million square foot workspaces, the graphics for them to, yeah, I guess to bigger, bigger highlights of doing a TEDx talk on creativity and how to design a better future. yeah, and a condensed, a very condensed space there that's kind of like many things.
Doug Jones (03:42)
Yeah, well we'll get into some of the some of the details on that but I know that you made a pretty significant pivot in your your life and then your in your career leaving the relative I Say safety is as much of a grind as it is in corporate life, but as a as a senior person in a major brand
deciding to give that all up and kind of move into what was more meaningful to you. But maybe you can share kind of what that moment was and why that happened and what you got into from there.
Keith Jones (04:25)
Yeah, that's a bigger question too. think it's a compounding decision. think it's like some of those experiences, previous to me jumping ship, I do it's volunteer work and helping out different spaces. had two nephews that were born. then thinking about it before that even, I was in a motorcycle accident and all of a sudden I'm cruising down
Doug Jones (04:28)
Yeah.
Keith Jones (04:55)
downtown Toronto and truck pulls in front of me and next thing you know I'm staring at the bumper of a Dodge Durango with a doctor who was rushing to get to the hospital and my motorcycle is 50 feet away laying on the street with the handlebars ripped off and all this stuff and like wow, a foot lower and I'd probably be, right? The head would have been flipped backwards or I'd be, I wouldn't be able to do a lot of things. So I always take, I take stock and signs and I'm not sure that was one but reflecting on it,
I think I'm kind of reflecting on it right now. That definitely was one of the things. And yeah, and then the combination of that, think reflection in the periods and those little elements that you kind of experience through life to give you signs. You're always given little signs. And it's our job to like, to listen to those signs. And a lot of times we don't listen to them. just keep headed down, go to work, do our thing, right? And whereas I'm a pretty intuitive person. So I'm always listening. It's weird because it's part of my job, but it's also...
Doug Jones (05:26)
Yeah.
Keith Jones (05:53)
listening to it. And then the second stage would have been, I think reaching milestones too, would have been working my way up the corporate ladder, right? Working and doing design, do identity packages for organizations. And you start building brand packages and you're like launching the NHL with Rogers and this bigger package. And then we did a rebrand for Rogers, which is like a $35 million cap investment. We're doing like 600 retail stores of what does the digital signage look like? What's the back of cash look like? What do the little name cards look like?
So all these pieces in retail stores across the country and then we worked on my love and passion for space and architecture came with branding when we did ShareSpace, which was the largest office transformation program in Canadian history. And all of a sudden this project is laying on my lap and I say, it's me, but it's we. Every time it was a team and amazing people I got to work with along the way. But we were building like whole new office spaces, like the we work of corporate.
corporate world 10 years ago. So we're ahead of the time, but we're doing these really amazing, huge projects. And then I got to this point where, okay, you did this thing, you did this thing, you did this thing, and what's next is the, not a creative director, but a director of creative services. So it would have been overseeing and managing like 60 people, maybe 70 people in house in that department. And I thought.
I want to manage a bunch of finicky creative people. I'm a finicky creative person. I don't want to manage 60 of me, no way. So that didn't sound too, it's appealing and like I could probably do it. It'd be a great career advancement and a great opportunity, but I'm also just selling widgets, right? I'm also just selling internet, which is not a bad thing. I'm super appreciative of all the opportunities I had working with Rogers and all the great work we did and all the great people we met and the output of that and the learning. it's like, like you can't measure that, right? But.
Doug Jones (07:22)
Yeah. Yeah.
Keith Jones (07:46)
There's something inside me. There's that little voice inside me, that little seed I talked about before saying, all right, there's something bigger here. There's something you need to do before you die. There's something that's calling you to do something more. And at the same point, I guess there would be a third item in our bucket list of three things that are motivating us. Earlier that year, Donald Trump was voted in power. This dichotomy of red versus blue, you vote for, don't care, but it was just like the polarization of politics.
Australia was on fire, this massive forest fire. 20 of last 20 years were like the hottest on record, like pollution. Let's not talk about climate change, let's talk about pollution, right? And so that mixed with having two nephews, having these life-affirming moments was like, what's next? What am I doing? Why am I doing it, right? So you kind of have to, at a certain point in our lives, have to, and it was also late 30s coming up in 40, wait, what's that milestone like? What's happens in your 40s? What do you do, right? And so, yeah, I think those are.
Doug Jones (08:43)
Yeah. No, I, it's, it's funny, near death experience is often a trigger for, I gotta change what I'm doing. So that, that's an interesting point, but I think.
Keith Jones (08:44)
I don't know if I answered your question, I just rambled.
Doug Jones (09:05)
you know, your journey to leave that corporate space, a lot of people can't do that. What I've seen is a lot of people get locked into those milestones that you talked about, those next steps, and always trying to get up that ladder a little bit more. And it's interesting to see that, I see it in entrepreneurship as well.
and somebody told me not too long ago and maybe it was you who said you got a lot of entrepreneurs have a mind like a goldfish to quote Ted Lasso but saying you know you do this thing and then immediately you say well what's next
and you kind of have to, it's almost like that dopamine rush of success. Like you achieve something and then you need another fix. You need to keep going. So it's interesting that you mentioned that climbing of the corporate ladder piece. But as you moved out of that, I know you...
you left that and you and your wife are both creatives and you started Brandvan and I don't think a lot of people are aware of what Brandvan is but maybe you can jump into that transition coming from that big corporate and dealing with those large office space transformations those sort of things to all of a
starting a brand van. Maybe you can explain what brand van is and what you did with it.
Keith Jones (10:43)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's kind of like, basically, I guess the first phase, the transition after Rogers was me taking a sabbatical, me taking some time off to go, what is my purpose here and what does the world need and how can I make impact? How can I make impact with my skillset? What's my genius? What's my super talent? Like I'm shit at taxes. I can't pay my taxes. I'm like, I struggle to get in time every year, right? But.
Doug Jones (11:10)
Yeah.
Keith Jones (11:11)
Creativity is my superpower, right? My ability to create new things and this brand and design thing is another little superpower. said, how can I make the world better with that skill set? What is it that I have that I can make accomplish while I am here and what does the world need? And so I kind of like, I ended up building, it sounds weird, but I built a strategy for life. Like what is the purpose of all our lives here and what's the purpose of my life here? And so.
from that came me starting this agency as an idea design consultancy. Like we're, you know, use creativity to, to, to solve bigger problems and partner with organizations that need things solved and help them along their way using kind of brand and innovation design. And I said, well, we're a creative company. We're making the world better. Let's go fucking make the world better. Pardon me. How do we the world better? Right. Do it. Right. And a lot of people who are a lot of people just.
Doug Jones (11:58)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Keith Jones (12:04)
talk about it and a lot of people start the big multimedia or multimillion dollar agency and then they'll give the one day of a year back to a charity and I'm like, nothing's gonna get solved by that. I said to my partner, Vicky, I said, hey, I'm thinking about this thing and we had these conversations and all of a sudden we're gonna drive across Canada and help charities. How do we make Canada a better place? Canada's a freaking amazing country but it needs some help.
how to make Canada a better place and let's drive across Canada and help out charities and nonprofits. And then it turned into, well, we could volunteer to soup kitchen or we can give a brand design system to a soup kitchen so that they can help market themselves and promote themselves and get better funding and get sponsorship opportunities. And so we just bought a van, it's trades van, it's empty shell of a van and we built out a really cool interior design component of it.
I told my builder to help me before I said, hey, got to own a build a van. He's like, go fly a kite. And I had to build out schematics and designs before I even owned the van. I'm trying to persuade him to do this. So yeah, in the summer we ended up building out the interior design of this van, a work live space. then in September, September we drove to the East coast in Canada and met charities and nonprofits along the way.
in October, we drove to the west coast of Canada and met charities and nonprofits along the way and we gave advice and then we started doing brand work with them. And then, the concept changed, shaped into, crowdsourcing. So how do we, instead of, you know, we hear crowdfunding before we fund an idea and which I probably should have done because I took all my money and brought some money from the bank to get this, this project off the ground. but it was crowdsourcing to get the job done. was all about outcomes, right? And so we crowdsourced these super
amazing, talented people, whether it's copywriters or animators or web developers. How do we use our skillsets to not sell a widget or our cable package, which again, Roger's your amazing company, but it was like, this can actually move the needle for people that are hungry or people that need a house or some of that stuff. And also that awareness tool too, right? And we're giving away confidence to the leaders of those organizations so they can...
Put a badge on their t-shirt, be confident that they're pitching and selling and have the right tools and marketing tools and pride for the people that are working there and volunteering there. Because a lot of times charities have just kind of crap brand, right? And so let's have the people and the volunteers go, wow, I want a sack t-shirt. I want to force the reading t-shirt. Make cool merch, make the brand exciting and accessible and interesting. And then dignity would be the last component. Like the people that are getting services, they're what? We view charity as well.
Doug Jones (14:46)
Right.
Keith Jones (14:51)
It's charity, so let's just give them the trash, let's give them the leftover, let's give them the scraps, right? it's like, no, like, let's, I'm doing something for a charity, it has to be as good if not better than the Fortune 500 companies that I do brand work for. Like, let's, they're humans, we're human, we all want the same thing, they just happen to have a couple hurdles to get there. They didn't have a nurse and a farmer for parents who happened to get lucky and survive through shitty times, they fell down during shitty times, so.
We're all human, right? And so that was like the confidence, pride, and dignity were really three key elements for that experience.
Doug Jones (15:20)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it's amazing.
You know, I've worked with a lot of these charities and not-for-profits across the country, and you're exactly right. They don't necessarily have the same tools in their toolbox as bigger companies, but the work that they're doing impacts society in general. And to help uplift those organizations to achieve
more and do more, you know, the impact of that is tremendous. So, so it's pretty amazing. The challenge, of course, is you spent all your own money to get this off the ground, which is sometimes challenging, but, it kind of turned, turned into and good company, your current company and, and this crowdsourcing model is interesting that, that you can
utilize this skill set of a variety of creatives around the country or around the world to solve some of these challenges. And what's interesting about that is that you're actually able to leverage some of the beliefs and values of those creatives to the connect them to those not-for-profits and stuff. it's kind of a
Keith Jones (16:53)
Thank
Doug Jones (16:57)
an interesting web you've created here that could be a model for other businesses. it's like how do you capture those creatives? Like how do you reach out? Because I assume they're distributed globally in some cases. How do you build that team? And how do you inspire that team to participate?
Keith Jones (17:24)
Yeah, think there's, to answer your question in a couple different ways. One would be we didn't have as far reach as we could have, mainly because it was all in a shoestring, right? So imagine we had a million dollars to help build that campaign and tell people about what we're doing and then assist them to like impact larger groups on a larger scale to like get back. So the awareness is literally, just, it was Vicky.
My partner Vicki who's freaking amazing and she's in the world of marketing and digital marketing and she's the smart one in the relationship and her and her network and me and my network and that's kind of how it all started. It was just like, hey, let's tell some people we did a couple posts and we're not, it sounds weird but we're not social media. We do, we're on social media but we're not like people, some people are beat the drum and build their audience, build their brand whereas I'm a doer and a builder and a maker.
Doug Jones (18:03)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
the end.
Keith Jones (18:21)
But it was literally through conversations. It was through us telling our friends and I had a couple of friends and I'm like, yeah, I'm doing this thing. He's like, how can I help? And I remember the conversation I had with him and he's, it was the friend I wasn't expecting to jump on board, but he's like, tell me what I need to do. He works in the web world. He's like, whatever I can do, I can do. And this was Mark and he built the digital side of the Bum Run charity that we did, which is a pretty funny project. But he's just like, so many of those friends just said.
Doug Jones (18:45)
Yeah.
Keith Jones (18:47)
can I help? can I do?" And his perspective was, and some people wanted help because they saw the need and they knew that there was something calling to do more than just work for the corporation to make money to get their paycheck. There's a calling. People wanted it, right? They wanted it as much as I did. Maybe not as much as I did because they didn't quit the job, but they wanted it. And then there's another group of people like Mark, who I just mentioned. He was like, no, because people say they're going to do something,
Doug Jones (19:09)
Yeah.
Keith Jones (19:17)
And they don't do it where you, Jones, you're fucking doing it, right? He's like, I want to help because you're like, because you're doing it. Right. And so there's like, which, which fueled me, which fueled my, my energy is not like people go, yeah, cheering you on. And some people cheered and said, I'm to help. And didn't show up when I reached out. Right. And that's just people that get busy and there's time on it. they have other life things going on or maybe they get excited about an idea and don't show up. And so I try not to, at first I was little perturbed by those friends that offered that didn't show up. And then I was like, everybody's busy.
Everybody's got their own life, their own thing on the go. then, and then other people would just tell their friends or repost things and make things, people are showing up. It was really cool.
Doug Jones (19:52)
Yeah.
Yeah, it's a real grassroots type of model, but I think it says a lot about your leadership is, and I think you made an interesting point, is that you were demonstrating.
what it is, how you wanted to change the world. And I find leaders that do that inspire other leaders and other leaders want to get involved. And clearly that's what's happening with this grassroots kind of expansion of what you're doing. you know, giving back to the world instead of being always driven by economic outcomes. That's
That's kind of the model that's interesting to me is that you can do both. You can create economic opportunity for yourself, but you can also do good in the world. And whether that's in sustainability projects or just uplifting the people around you is very inspiring to me. But I think to a lot of people, they want to be part of those things. So it speaks a lot to the leadership qualities that you're
you're bringing out. I think we have lot of young leaders emerging and young entrepreneurs starting out.
What advice do you think you would give a young entrepreneur or leader trying to make an impact in the world? Like what's your advice looking back at your journey that would have made you do this pivot or would have changed the way you work through your path? You may not have changed anything, but I think a lot of our younger leaders
maybe aren't jumping into spaces like this, what advice would you give them?
Keith Jones (22:03)
Yeah, think for me, certain things I would say I would change it completely. And other things, times I might just say, I wouldn't change a thing because every missed note or every failure is an opportunity to learn from it too, right? And I also, if you want to get woo-woo, can actually say that the world has a plan for you or the universe provides, but you must show up. And I've got a-
Doug Jones (22:16)
you
Keith Jones (22:32)
I've got a note on my door here and it says, got lots of notes all over my office, but one on the board says, be in the space doing, be in space doing. So whatever that is, and this is kind of echoes to a conversation we had the other day as well too Doug or with the group, but be in the space doing. So things aren't going to happen if you're at home on your phone. If you're just sitting there staring at a thing, things aren't going to happen unless you're out.
Doug Jones (22:36)
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
Keith Jones (22:58)
doing something. So every action gets a reaction and that reaction will get you a further step down. All right. And it may be a failure component or maybe a, Hey, brand van is wow. You gave everything away. It's not sustainable, but then it pivots over to this thing over here where this thing is sustainable and this thing is driving you or wow. You really decided that it's helping people, but I really like helping people. And I'm want to solve the housing crisis. It's here. How, what, let, let me dive down that, that pathway. Right. And
I remember listening to David Suzuki few years ago and one of the students in the audience raised their hand as a younger person. It was like, it's overwhelming. The world is in crisis. There's this, there's this, there's this, there's this. There's all these things, right? And he had all these issues that he was flagging with David. He's like, I'm wrong, I don't know what to do. And David's like, well, to be honest with you, the world is kind of screwed, right? And you can't fix it all, but you can fix one thing.
So you can make one decision to fix one thing and focus on one thing. So I think you can get focused on whatever that thing is and figure out how to take some action. So indirectly I'm saying take an action and get focused in on something because it might not be the thing, but it'll get you further, right? It'll get you going.
Doug Jones (24:11)
Yeah, I think that's solid advice is that action is is the key take and even if it's small
I've had this conversation with my kids over the last little while. I mean, their world is different than our world growing up. And it can be overwhelming, as you said. And I use the analogy, and both of us grew up in hockey, I use the analogy of, you can't turtle.
You can't just hide inside your shell and let it happen. You need to take some sort of action, especially on things that are passionate or meaningful to you. I think that's a good analogy.
Doug Jones (25:03)
So Keith, I just wanted to circle back on Bumrun because this is something that you and I have talked about before and it's a pretty interesting project that you're involved in. So maybe you can highlight what that was and what the branding, because it's a really fun and innovative way that you presented this around a very serious topic. So maybe give our listeners a bit of an overview of what that was.
Keith Jones (25:32)
Yeah, I guess first I'll set a note about what Bumrun is. It's a 5k run to raise awareness for colon cancer and colon cancer actually happens to be the second leading cause of death by cancer in Canada. So pretty big issue. And Ian reached out to us. He's the guy who championed and started the Bumrun and he had some pretty crappy creative, no pun intended, but he...
We got together and a few of my friends that were working on this project, we kind of just started jamming on it. And I've got a friend of mine, one of my best friends, Ryan Taylor, he's got a little potty humor. And we came up with the idea of really making a joke about it all or really breaking down the stigma by like adding comedic relief to the situation. And obviously the symbolism and the imagery and the language around butt cheeks, it's...
My four year old son is, already saying butt jokes, right? He's into that world. so how do we make it fun and interesting? And there's a typical view of what charities should be and charities have to be this really, I don't wanna say dark, but really serious thing and really empathetic towards the cause and this negative perspective on a charity could be or lack of something exciting and fun.
Doug Jones (26:30)
You
Keith Jones (26:51)
We thought, well, how do get people talking about butts? Like, let's, let's just make it funny, make it hilarious and make it, make it a joke. So we had some great copywriters that joined us and, Mark out built the website and Arianne does some really interesting fun lines. And so it's like, literally the logo is the CN tower of the butt cheeks, right? It's, it's like, put it in your face and really talk about it a little bit more.
and put it out there so people go, whoa, this is a serious thing, you're no avoidance, no like, well, this thing you gotta do. It's like, let's get people talking about it. Let's get people having a conversation about it. And you have this amazing animator, I think I mentioned before, but this amazing animator from France. I reached out to him on Instagram, hey man, wow, this is like, sure, I only have a limited amount of time, but it's a really good cause and let's do something really, really great for it. Even the animation, low budget, low.
low quality, not I say low quality, it's high quality, but it was done in just a quick amount of time and it tells a story and it brings the whole thing full circle. yeah, if you have a chance to check out, go for the run or just check out some of the marketing material, because it's fun and it just shows you take it from a different angle, you get a different output on it.
Doug Jones (27:57)
Yeah.
Yeah, I think it's a very Canadian way you approach that design work and things. Canadians are typically very good at poking fun at ourselves and to take a very serious topic like colon cancer and make it fun and inviting. It kind of builds community, which is kind of the goal, I guess, in branding.
amazing job. would encourage everybody to check that out.
it's also that power of community and bringing in those people from different countries, different places in the world and bringing in their expertise around it because colon cancer doesn't just exist in Canada, it exists everywhere. And I think everybody has a touch point with things like this. it's cool that you can use your superpowers to do good, I guess.
So, kind of what's next for Anggood Company for you? Like, where are you going with the company? Are you continuing to expand and do new and interesting projects?
Keith Jones (29:18)
Yeah, yeah. We've got a lot of projects in the go right now. I guess to the most kind of leaning more into as much social impact stuff as I can while also taking out some, know, the Fortune 500 clients that helped pay the bills as well. Like we did a big couple of week photo shoots over the past couple of years with Dispresso has recently become a B Corp, which is if the artist does no benefit corp, which is kind of let's go make money and let's go do things, good things in the world and have some checks and balances in there. And I think that's, I actually think that's the future of all organizations are.
social impact organizations. We're helping people plan that end profit. I think that's the metrics for the future of every company. And if you're not jumping on that now, you should be, because I think that's what the next generation of kids want. We're talking about looking at different jobs and different opportunities. If you can figure out that metrics and if you're going to start something new, how do you balance all of those things? For us as an organization right now, the other thing we're working on is
Autism 101, is like this, language and the narrative around autism is totally changing and shaping into less of a disability, more of just a difference. And we're working on a series of animated videos and content pillars and pieces just to teach the general public what autism is. And so we're working on that for an autism center in Scarborough, which is.
I started working like six years ago when they forgot the first building and now they've blown up to three different locations. They're doing a musical this weekend and they're getting funding to do interesting things like teach people what autism is. So not only helping support people, like supporting the greater group of Canadians and even internationally. We're hoping to translate it into different languages as well, like Tamil and Urdu and English and maybe start to get into some different languages beyond that.
That's the first one. Yeah. And the other one I'm working on actually, I got to start it soon is we're building a website for a group I helped brand last year called Quest and it's a STEM learning in a hybrid environment. So it's basically an attachment to public school or public and private school that need to have STEM learning built into their curriculum. And we're helping them build the website for it. So the marketing material around that and kind of communication collateral.
along with that as well too. So it's a super interesting that you could get, get STEM learning for your, your, your classroom out of a Silicon Valley company. That's just like, just kind of create this digital portal for resources and learning. So that's really cool.
Doug Jones (31:41)
Yeah.
Wow. Yeah, it's it's amazing. It's that it's that combination of economic opportunity with
doing good in the world, which is tremendous. And it comes back to that, you know, I like to hike and spend time in the woods. And it's always about do no harm or leave nothing behind sort of thing. But yours is about leaving legacy behind and impact behind, is very interesting to me. One last thing, and Keith, you and I have shared book topics back and forth.
and often recommend books to each other. What's your number one recommendation right now for books, for listeners that might be in the creative space or interested in what you're doing? What book would you recommend to them today?
Keith Jones (32:50)
Yeah, this is a book we had shared conversation on before, is Rick Rubin's The Creative Act, which is like a really, it's kind of like, you can just pick it up to any passage or can read it end to end if you want. I've kind of got it on my fireplace mantle and I'll pull it off and just give it a skim every now and then and kind of get into it. But it's kind of like building, how to build towards the idea of being creative every day and incorporating creativity in your life.
leveraging those outputs, I guess, and staying true to it. It's a little bit more on the pure creative side is the intrinsic versus extrinsic driven ideas. But I think there's a lot of little wisdom and nuggets and beautiful things in there. if I, a few years ago, I thought about writing a few, I do have on my checklist to write a few books myself. And we'll talk to our friend Aaron about that in future. But
Doug Jones (33:27)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Keith Jones (33:45)
this was one of the books I was like, yeah, I'm gonna write a book on creativity. And all of a sudden, Rirk Rubin comes out with this masterpiece. I don't have to do it anymore. And I couldn't do it. And so I couldn't do it to his level of quality. So I compete. So it's a different view on things. So it's really, really brilliant.
Doug Jones (33:52)
Yeah.
Yeah, well.
I think you bring a lot to the table of your own unique perspective on the world and your experience. So I think that's, you know, I'll be the first one to read your book. So, so, but listen, I appreciate your time and taking part and being part of the ignited podcast and really enjoyed hearing your story and your insights. And we wish you all the best with and good company. And again, have fun with your young family and,
I got a glimpse of your young fella earlier and I'm sure you'll have lot of fun with him teaching him all about the good things in the world.
Keith Jones (34:39)
Yeah, same with you. It's like it's I'd like to say it's all me, but it's not on me. It's all their tribe. It's all their people. It's all the individuals. If you lived a little bit closer, I'd be like, you know, come over here, give them some, give them some lessons, Doug, give them some of your knowledge too, right? And so maybe that's what this whole experience is for, right? Even me paying it forward to those young professionals and our little guys. Once he lets me sleep at night, I think we're going to be in a good spot for helping mentor him a little bit.
Doug Jones (34:53)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, good stuff. thanks again and listen, enjoy the day and and we'll be talking very soon. Cheers.
Keith Jones (35:10)
Thank you.
Awesome, thanks Doug, have a great day.
